The pernicious influence of immigrants in the UK

Look here and here

Don't forget:

http://royalnews.newsvine.com/

Thanks Dennis + Ted.

Christ, it appears that Daily Mail readers can operate computers after all - who'd have thunk it. That kind of ignorant fear-mongering is disturbing, but I actually feel good that it's on Newsvine - it exposes it for the hateful ignorance that it really is, and gets good debate going over what is a difficult subject.

I've been an immigrant in 2 countries, The Netherlands and the US. We moved to the Netherlands in 1970, and were the first foreigners in our neighbourhood. We suffered some abuse, namely name calling, but nothing major - a lot of it was just kids

Here in the US, the only thing I have suffered are the attentions of laydeez who just luuuuurve my accent. It's not all bad.

what have the Romans ever done for us?

This alphabet we're all using.

Dennis: This alphabet we're all using.

and aquaducts.

Excellent list, but just remember that most of the Roman stuff is irrelevant to the people you're complaining about as most of them would have had at least some Norman heritage. When the Normans invaded large swathes of true "Brits" were pushed into Wales and Cornwall (or killed). Isn't it ironic most of the people complaining about immigrants are probably descended from immigrants who took control of the country by deadly force.

Reminds me of the situation here...

Might I point out that chocolate with milk in it, which is to say MOST chocolate,
was an idea pioneered by a man named Sloane, who was descended from the 7 original Irish families.

So no cadburys dairy milk for you.

-Dave

I guess that kills that old saying whatever it is "As American as Apple Pie"....

I sure cannot talk with a 100% Norwegian dad and mixture Irish/German Mom :-)

I feel this mixture is, in fact, typically British.

Thats typical ? Hah ! I would say you have a very diverse and interesting family tree and one well worth tracing out.

Given that the majority of Americans are descended from relatively recent immigrants, I think the phrase "as American as apple pie" is totally apt.

Reminds me of Frank Burns in the TV series of MASH. The most overly patriotic American in the Korean war, whose proud family arrived in America as far back as... 1927.

It's just amazing to go back to the Washington DC area and you can see places as old as 1890 or go to Williamsburg, VA and see a complete town with buildings all marked with the dates they were built, from 1699-1780. Until..opps they are all accurately-recreated to look just like that....oh well...yeah, the US is kinda young compared to most other places....

Tedd, we have churches and castles and Manor Houses dating back to the 11th and 12 centuries in Britain.

Let's see...

We have buildings from the Hittite, Assyrian, Persian, Greek, Roman, Seljuk and Ottoman Empires in Turkey.

We win.

That's absolutely true. There's no building here older than 1800 in Tasmania. But there are aboriginal flints, middens, and rock carvings going back over 30 thousand years. Which makes you stop and think.

It sure makes anyone with an ounce of brains stop and think before they talk about "immigrants".

Actually....I kinda figured someone would figure I was being my sarcastic self. Since I was born in Stuttgart, Germany, grew up in Bergen Norway and then came to the young US...I am always amazed also when people walk around "old town Seattle" and gaze the the ancient building dating back to 1890 :-)... (Most of Seattle was destroyed in a large fire) Yes I think Dennis has all beat unless someone here is from Greece (or Atlantis....)

We have "Historic Buildings" that are that way just because of what they are connected to. The Mar's Company (Candy) HQ is a "historic building", the plain dull boring ugly Government building that had the first Arpanet connection is now "historic" We just added a Denny's Restaurant (which I hate !) as "historic" in Seattle, for some stupid reason. It is from about 1950 !

Haha! bluejohnnyd meet Feorag. Feorag...bluejohnnyd. There, now we're all friends! :)

Michael Howard is the son of a Romanian Jew, the family changed their name shortly after they immigrated to UK. I have met Michael many times he is a very clever intelligent man and a true patriotic person who is anti EU. Shame he never made Prime Minister. However some of his debates with 'Tony B' at prime minister question time where the best I have ever heard from a shadow prime minster. He is not a racialist as far as I know. I used to live in Folkstone of which is his constituency

He said sport, not golf. ;-)

No, you're correct. The first documented game was played in Edinburgh in the mid 15th century.

spifster

He said sport, not golf. ;-)

The Wee Icemon would jerk a knot in your tail for that crack if he were still around.

Your experience of Brits learning the local language and mixing in with the locals has not been mine. In the Netherlands where I grew up, most of the Brits I knew (and I knew a lot, as I went to the British School in the Netherlands) did not learn Dutch, nor did they have any Dutch friends.

The women all joined "The British Womens Club" (yech) and had coffee mornings, the men went to work, then went home, no-one mixing with the Dutch. Most of the British school kids played together and it was rare for them to have Dutch friends. Luckily, there were exceptions, my family among them. I am bilingual in Dutch and English, as are both my sisters. My parents both speak Dutch albeit with English accents, but at least they bothered to learn - they were not the norm in that respect. They still live there today, and have many Dutch friends

I have a few British Friends who have lived there for over 30 years who cannot even speak Dutch!

Thank you, Babel, for explaining that one. I have recently been called a "Racist", an " Xenophobe", and quite a few unwarranted slurs.

It seems that many of my comments are not too popular with a certain element here on Newsvine.

It seems that many of my comments are not too popular with a certain element here on Newsvine.

Those who oppose bigotry and racism, I would imagine.

You can vote "Tory", doesn't mean that you are one, you can vote "Labour", you do not need to be a card-carrying Member of the Labour Party.

The same thing applies to the Green Party, U.K.I.P., or the Monster Raving Loony Party!

Ever heard of the term "Floating Voter?"

Feorag - my parents had the same problem - as soon as they tried to speak Dutch, the Dutch would speak English to them - they gad to insist constantly that they speak in Dutch. They were just being helpful, and they *do* generally speak very good English.

It was easier for myself and my sisters - I was 5 when I moved there and played with Dutch kids, just picked up the language like a sponge, as kids do.

As I have lived in the Haigh Holland whilst looking for a job in IT, I soon found out I had to learn Dutch before any employer would employ me. I speak German and learning Dutch was in fact complicated due to that fact. The fact that the Dutch switch to English when ones practising the language, and the dirty looks I got when accidental using a similar German word. I of course realised that I had better immigrate elsewhere because my money would run out before I start speaking the language fluent enough to get a job.

However I found a nice British hangout a bar called the Kangaroo Bar, I was amazed how many British especially Scots spoke Dutch fluently and worked in the capital. Times are changing where as the British used to be very lazy at learning languages. All of my children are multi lingual.

As for Immigrants in UK not speaking English, it is a growing problem as a person who has lived in Asian and African communities its something I know well. I have even heard some of my Indian friends in Hong Kong and China that they have cousin, sisters and brothers and friends in UK that can hardly speak a word of English.

That one of the reasons the government are now following many of their european counterparts by insisting all nationalised immigrants speak the national tongue.

Feorag - my parents had the same problem - as soon as they tried to speak Dutch, the Dutch would speak English to them - they gad to insist constantly that they speak in Dutch. They were just being helpful, and they *do* generally speak very good English.

The same as Germany, it is most unfortunate that more Europeans speak English than than the English (myself included) speak their own. One of my best friends is from Hamburg, and frequently reminds me never to give away that I might be English in Germany, else I'll never learn the language.

wenn du fertig bist, warte nicht bis irgendwas passiert, sonst verbleibe ich getrennt von dir?

Sie sind nicht Deutscher ?

Whoa...I would say you summed that one up perfectly between the various countries on use of languages. I learned early on, just knowing a little of the language sure goes a long way, same with knowing a little about the country or culture, you get treated much differently.

Reminds me of a 3 day business trip spanning 5 countries a few years ago. Starting from London and ending in Paris via Oslo, Stockholm and Brussels with just English and French as my lingo.

My brain had been exposed to all those different languages en route, with really only having to switch to one another language for communication needs en route whilst in Brussels. I was in the ticket booth Q at CDG for the train into town. By the time I got to the front, I was totally disoriented about where I was and which lingo my brain needed to switch to. Just stood there like a lemon. Even when the guy pressed impatiently with a questioning "Oui, monsieur?".

I think I eventuallu blurted out something in bit-French, bit-English and a lorra Martian. The look on his face said it all. Something like bleeding aliens:-)

Since we're telling these stories...

When I was 18, a friend and I did the Europe-tour thing. Not long in, my friend caught chicken pox (and I later caught it from him, the fun!). Anyway, there I was in Rome, he was sick in bed, and I had an Italian phrase book which was no doubt useful in all sorts of circumstances, but not for people looking for help with chicken pox. After saying 'farmacia' (courtesy of the phrasebook) to a policeman, and following his finger, I found a pharmacy and realised that I had no idea how to tell them the issue.

So I scratched.

I pointed to imaginary spots all over my body.

I did the chicken dance.

I reckon those two pharmacists still talk about me a dinner parties.

Haha - thanks for that - I haven't seen it for ages!

Great find and very apropos. Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose.

NTNON did a fair few skits on racism I recall one about an overzealous police office trying to press charges on a black gentleman for being in possession of "Curly black hair and an offensive wife".

NTNON

One of the best from that era. I saw Rowan do a one man show at the height of NTNON. Pure genius.

Don't forget "Loitering with intent to use a pedestrian crossing."

I haven't seen that one, and have been looking for it on youtube with no success. A great pity, it sounds really good :)

Its eons since I've been to Leicester. Plenty of guju veggie restos in London now. But the last visit about 10 years ago came as a shock. At the height of influx following the break up of Yugoslavia, Belgrave Road was rather full of mothers begging with their children in tow. Very aggressive too, and early on a Sunday morn. One even managed to sneak in at the restaurant we were in. Made it very awkward for the staff as she kept on staring at diners, wouldn't leave and staff felt compelled to feed her a meal that she had no intention (nor means) to pay for.

Let me know if you're in London, Feorag.

hotel by Heathrow.

For Easter ? Thats no fun !

Oh.......well that kinda sorta changes the whole picture around, whenever I hear Heathrow + Hotel, my mind goes back into recall mood of the many times that PanAm or Lufthansa or United or whatever has stranded me there for a day or so....

Your visit sounds awesome...

I have never been to Heathrow when they are not doing some form of construction on the place and the signs are mixed up and left over from last time they did construction, drives me crazy, I have missed many a flight because of that.